This episode dives into the chaotic world of wingmanning and wingwomaning in polyamorous dating. The cast shares real-life stories of how helping a partner flirt can easily turn into blocking them instead. There is a strong mix of humor and truth as the group explores what enthusiastic consent looks like in public spaces — and how jealousy, obliviousness, and possessiveness can shape the night.
There are no conclusions, no clean lessons — just funny and relatable moments that make the poly dating learning curve universal.
Alonzo Banx(Host), Jon, Patty, Cupcake, Heather
Alonzo Banx (00:00)
Welcome back to the Polysilk Cow Podcast. I am Alonzo Banks. We’ve got John Patty Cupcake Heather in the house tonight and we’re going to be talking about how to be a wingman and how not to mess that up. So with that, hi everyone.
Heather (00:15)
Hi!
Cupcake (00:15)
Hello?
Jon (00:15)
Hello.
Alonzo Banx (00:16)
Welcome. Okay, so we’ll do the fast one tonight. Go around everyone say who they are and let’s go with the way my screen order is. John, good evening.
Jon (00:24)
Hello, I’m John. am part of Polycule. That includes my wife, Patty, my girlfriend, Heather, and my metamorphobib. And poly for 30 years and still trying to figure it out. So here I am.
Alonzo Banx (00:37)
And we’ve got two of those three on tonight. Patty.
Patty (00:41)
Hi, I’m Patti. I am married to John. I’m engaged to Heather. I’m dating Beeb, and I am also dating someone in a separate relationship.
Alonzo Banx (00:50)
Come back. Cupcake.
Cupcake (00:52)
I was gonna say, John said he’s still figuring it out and he’s been doing it for 30 years and I’m just like, well crap! Hi, I’m Kev Gank. I have been married to my husband for three and a half years and then I’ve also been in a relationship with Noah and Cookie for about a year and a half, I guess. Now we’re getting there. So those have been my only successful…
Patty (00:56)
Hehehehehe ⁓
Jon (00:56)
you
Alonzo Banx (00:58)
You ⁓
Cupcake (01:18)
open relationships, but I’ve had a couple of other relationships that were not so successful before that, so I don’t know how you- I’m figuring it out, I guess. Come on, John.
Jon (01:27)
Thank you.
Alonzo Banx (01:28)
That’s
Patty (01:28)
Yeah
Alonzo Banx (01:30)
why John is saying it’s taken 30 years and he’s still figuring it out. And I can tell you, it doesn’t get any easier over time. Heather, welcome.
Jon (01:33)
Don’t follow me.
you
Heather (01:39)
Hi, I’m Heather. I’m married to the Biebs, engaged to Patty Cakes and John is my boyfriend and I got my shit figured out, so…
Alonzo Banx (01:48)
Hahaha
Cupcake (01:50)
Bye!
Alonzo Banx (01:50)
Well, that’s why we need you here to help out the rest of us. I know I never did figure it out. all right. So the question tonight is interesting ⁓ trials and tribulations, successes, and some of the unfortunate missteps in being a wingman or a wing woman. What has happened to you and how did it work? And sometimes not.
Jon (01:50)
you
Cupcake (01:52)
Shoo’d.
Jon (01:53)
You
Alonzo Banx (02:13)
He’s got something for me.
All right, John. ⁓ Patty too, but I called John already.
Jon (02:19)
So, yes, I have been wingman by my lovely wife, Patty, a few times, actually. The very first time that I really remember this happening was I was going to go to Vegas with some friends and I didn’t really have a whole lot of plans there. Like I wasn’t going with anybody that I was going to be playing with or anything. But there was this
I put a post out, I think it was on Craigslist or something like that, saying that I’m gonna visit. was like in the Personals kind of section when Craigslist was cooler. And this woman responded to me and said, hey, I’m gonna be in Vegas at the same time. Like, I’d be interested in hanging out. So we started chatting. This was like Yahoo chat or something like that. And we communicated a few times and at some point, I had to let her know about why I’m married and stuff.
Swinger, Polly and all this stuff or whatever. And she’s like, oh, that’s not, that’s different. And so she was kind of uncomfortable with it. I said, if you’d like, can get you in touch with my wife and you can talk to her about it. And, know, in case you’re concerned. And, uh, so she said, yeah, actually I would like to talk to her. So I connected them in chat and, uh, you know, she just kind of confirmed the things that I’d said to her with Patty. And then Patty started to actually be like,
you should really sleep with my husband. It’s a good time. should try that. So she was like, my God, what an endorsement. And, and so I ended up in Vegas and spent like a weekend together. My friends were trying to figure out their life, but I was having a great old time with this new friend of mine in Vegas. So that was successful. And then most recently there was a girl at the club that we all attend that
I was thinking about playing with, but I wasn’t really sure if she was into it yet or anything. Like we’d have a couple of conversations, but Patty was like, yeah, she wants to trust me. And I’m like, all right. Patty walks over to her and basically says, hey, do you want to have sex with my husband? She’s like, which one is that, right? She wasn’t sure who was her husband. And she’s the photographer. It’s like, oh, yeah.
Yeah, I want to do that. Well, thank God. was just surprising. I don’t know if that works for guys in that same scenario, whether I could have said, hey, you want to sleep with Patty’s husband or what? so yeah, don’t know if that works out the other way, but it was unusually successful for me in that moment.
Patty (04:35)
You
Alonzo Banx (04:43)
Well, know, Patty might be giving you a ringing endorsement as a lover, but I think you just gave her that endorsement as a wingwoman. Patty, I gotta let you step up now. You just got put up on a major pedestal of wingwoman.
Jon (04:43)
this one.
Yeah.
Patty (04:53)
Heh.
Jon (04:54)
you
You
Patty (05:00)
I will wing woman the hell out of a situation. I think it can be challenging for guys and you don’t want to come off as the creepy guy, the guy that’s predatory. So it can be a challenge. if I see that John or some, know, Beebs is interested in somebody, I will wing man the hell out of the situation.
It’s bitten me in the butt a few times, I’m not gonna lie. yeah, and the story that John told was one that I was gonna tell recently with the girl at the club and she was very shy and John can tend to be a little bit shy so I was like, hey, you wanna be with that guy? Hey, he’s a good time. Raised my eyebrows up and down and I’ve done that a few times, so yeah.
Alonzo Banx (05:46)
Okay, okay, we know you’re a good wing woman, but you just made a statement in there that it’s bit you in the butt a few times. I can’t let that go, come on.
Patty (05:53)
Man.
Jon (05:53)
No.
Patty (05:56)
So, there has been a time where I wing manned for a certain individual, will not name the name of the partner, and that partner came back with a mark that was not previously discussed. And the amount of possessiveness and anger that I had was like, it
bothered me and bothered me and bothered me. And there’s nodding her head because it was just like ⁓ my gosh like something so simple like that right would bother me to the degree that it did and it really did and I don’t know that that individual that she was intentional with overstepping that bound.
Heather (06:23)
you
Patty (06:35)
boundary for me and it wasn’t really a boundary that we had discussed but it certainly was a discussion after like okay I don’t think I’m okay with this or that so it was a learning experience for me.
Alonzo Banx (06:47)
Okay, now you know I don’t like pushing for details, but that was really cryptic.
Patty (06:51)
We were at a club and it was Biebs and I wing manned him with a girl. I was like, hey, that’s my boyfriend. It’s a good time with you. And she was not used to women being that forward with like, you know, do you want to have sex with my boyfriend? And they did. And he came back with a mark on him and I was not stoked about it. It bothered me a lot. Yeah.
But we resolved it quickly. It was fine. We kind of joke and tease about it now. But at the time, I was really mad.
Alonzo Banx (07:22)
I gotta go to Heather. keep looking like you gotta say something here.
Patty (07:23)
Yeah.
Jon (07:25)
you
Heather (07:26)
But
Patti mentioned like, she didn’t know if the female was unintentional or intentional with it. I feel like for that particular mark, you know what you’re doing. I’m sorry. When you’re playing with someone, I think that is a boundary that is discussed prior to play about marks and what that boundary is for people. That is something I always ask. So that particular mark, you, that was intentional. So.
I didn’t care about it. I thought it was cute the way Patty reacted.
Patty (07:56)
He cared about it, but he was like, what the
heck? That’s my boyfriend, what are you doing? I share him with you and you don’t return him in the exact same condition? I was very mad. Very possessive and mad. And that doesn’t come out for me that often. it was like, whoa. Excuse me. You’re not getting your cleaning deposit back.
Jon (08:14)
So you should have taken a deposit.
Heather (08:16)
You
Alonzo Banx (08:16)
Yeah.
Jon (08:19)
you
Alonzo Banx (08:22)
Clearly you returned it damaged.
Patty (08:24)
Yeah!
Alonzo Banx (08:26)
Well, because everyone’s being so cryptic, I’m going to let it go. But I can tell you that me and everyone listening to this podcast is going the mark. ⁓ okay, okay.
Patty (08:35)
A hickey, it was a hickey, right smack on his chest
and I was like what the hell
Heather (08:40)
Yeah, I just don’t know
how that’s not intentional. A hickey’s intentional. I’m sorry. You have to work on doing that to somebody’s body. So I’m just gonna say that now. Like if you’re listening, ask before you leave a mark. Get that person’s, get the boundaries. Understand the boundaries. Yeah, especially if they’re not single.
Patty (08:57)
Yes.
Yes.
Alonzo Banx (09:02)
There are many marks that can be left, yes. Thank you for the clarification. Cupcake, you’re smiling away, being way too quiet tonight.
Yeah, you. Yeah.
Patty (09:12)
Yeah, OK.
Cupcake (09:13)
⁓ sorry.
There was a lot going on in this room like 10 seconds ago. I was like trying to keep it quiet and I was just like, my dog is freaking out. I know I’m not like purposely trying to be quiet. I mean, there’s a group that has the same experience. just don’t. I mean, my main wingman story is that I kind of
Jon (09:16)
You
Patty (09:16)
you
Cupcake (09:33)
initiated the relationship that my husband is currently in and I would say potential partner. They’re not officially partners, but they’ve been dating since June. And this individual actually knows my husband longer than I have. And one of the festivals that we went, we go to every year, I’ve only been doing it. I’ve been doing it one less year than my husband has. So he went one year before me.
And then I met him soon after his first year. Well, while they were at this festival, they met and they hooked up, you know, and that was whatever. It’s fine. You know, cares? But.
Ever since then, the first few years of my marriage, was healing from my own past traumas of bad open relationships. my husband and I decided to be pretty monogamous in the beginning of our relationship. There was always an ish for certain situations. But I kind of was, I knew about this individual, but I didn’t ever really want to.
get to know them at that time because it was me and my own insecurities. And then, you know, we would start talking about them in the last like year and just seeing them at these events and seeing them at Ren Fair. And, you know, I allowed myself to like kind of start getting to know, you know, her and going, OK, this might be beneficial. And
She would start, you know, posting because she lives up in LA, so she’s not in our area very often and was like posting, oh, I’m going to be out in the, you know, southern area more often if anybody wants to hang out that I know out there. And I was like, you could hang out with my husband, take him off my hands for a little while, like as a joke, just kind of like.
And then anytime there was a post that was like that, I kind of kept sneaking myself in and making some silly little jokes. like, oh, you know. And finally in June, a night that I was already planning to go over to Noah and Cookies, they had hung out and they talked for hours and hours. And it was actually kind of funny because I didn’t know what to.
come to, but I walked back into my home and they were both in bed just topless and cuddly and I was like, oh, hello. Oh, we’ve just been talking. I was like, oh, OK. It’s not a big deal. But then I just ended up getting topless and cuddly with them anyways. And so it’s kind of just been, it was often they would see each other every couple of weeks. And our festival came around at the end of September.
Something that she likes to do is get like a pass to one of the scare events during the October season. And it happened to be a lot closer to us. And she was like, oh, you know, I’m in the area. And we would offer for her to stay the night because it made sense. other than her driving all the way back up to LA at 2 a.m. in the morning, I was like, I’m not going to be that person. And I would say that that was
a few weekends of something I wasn’t quite ready for. Because it was just new for me and it was fine and I was, you know, it wasn’t something that like made me upset or it just like definitely was like testing like, oh, how do you feel about this? How do you feel about this? And you know, I’d be waking up at like 8am Sunday and they’d be sleeping until noon and I was just like, but what about breakfast? Like, hello, anyone?
Jon (13:03)
the
Cupcake (13:04)
And so yeah, it’s been an interesting experience, but I definitely have been assisting with that.
Jon (13:12)
Hehehe.
Alonzo Banx (13:12)
So how important, and we’ve covered this before, but how important is it to have a wingman or a wingwoman in the community?
Cupcake (13:18)
I mean, it was, I don’t know how important it is, but it definitely, just depends on the situation. mean, my part of the wing landing was kind of a little bit for me personally, you like I wouldn’t say it’s alter your motives, but like it was allowing me to be able to see how I felt in that situation and allowing myself to be like, okay, and like try something and see what happens and, but you know.
That’s my opinion on it. I kind of try to do it more if I can.
Alonzo Banx (13:48)
You know, I think that’s an important little sub note that just came up there is when your partner is wingmanning or wing womaning for you, not only are they helping you get over, as Patty put it, you know, the creepy person in the room, it gives you that, that nod, but it also makes your partner part of the process.
which can greatly ease that transition and greatly ease the situation because it gives you the affirmation that, my partner’s okay with me doing this. And it clearly makes the partner feel like I’m a proactive part of this decision. I’m a proactive part. I’m going go back to your second. Patty, you had something you wanted to add?
Patty (14:25)
Yeah, Alonzo, that’s what I was going to comment on, was that being a wing woman for John, number one, it does take him off the creepy guy list, and it does make me a part of the experience. But it also allows the woman to know that I am okay with what’s happening, because often if, no matter where you go,
If you are going in with your partner, people don’t know you’re a dynamic and more often than not women aren’t going to approach your spouse or same vice versa, right? Men and women aren’t going to approach your spouse while you’re right there. And so it kind of opens things up. It opens for dialogue, communication and all that. And we’ve had a lot of talk about communication.
And that is kind of a key component to that for me.
Alonzo Banx (15:20)
Yeah, you know, my mantra is, you know, overwhelming consent, know, proactive, got to get involved. Passive consent doesn’t work for me. And when a partner is being a wing person, they are truly in that super proactive consent situation. Heather, you have something you want to add?
Heather (15:37)
Just what Patty was saying on like Not necessarily in a wingmaning situation, but I’ve had women come up to me and be like hey I want to I want to play with Biebs. How do you feel about this? And they come and I just like making that person feel comfortable to explore my husband without any any hesitation on my part and having that open communication with them and that gives me the opportunity to be like
Hey yeah, you can do X, Y, and Z. Have a great time. Have at it.
Alonzo Banx (16:07)
Nice, go ahead John.
Jon (16:09)
Yo,
what is it? What is it that you’re saying to them about me? Just kidding.
Heather (16:15)
All right.
Cupcake (16:16)
I got stories.
Heather (16:20)
I like, I don’t like being
asked to wingman for somebody. I like it to be organic and natural and on my own terms. If you’re asking me to wingman for you, like do your own fucking work, man. I don’t know why you’re asking me to do shit. But I do it naturally on my own. Like, Beebs is seeing a person outside of our polycule right now and her and I met up quite a few times.
Jon (16:34)
you
Heather (16:45)
before him and her had a date. And on our hangouts, I would naturally just talk about Bebe and how comfortable I was with him with other people. And I would talk about what he’s like as a person and how caring he is and stuff like that. And everything I said about Bebe while we were hanging out motivated her to be like, okay, this sounds like a really great guy. I wanna…
you know explore that and she asked me first so I really liked that. I like inadvertently wingmanning for people.
Jon (17:18)
You know what I kind of like too is just that sometimes ⁓ like a second or third set of eyes who’s seen something going on like Patty could see something between this other girl and I that we would make a connection. I didn’t see it, but she did. And so when she facilitated that, it was really kind of cool.
Heather (17:35)
I feel like a lot
of men are oblivious to when women are hitting on them. But like, your spouse can tell. Like, I know when someone’s on Bebe. Like, I’m looking at you like, alright cool. And I know when someone’s hitting on John or look, oogling him too much and then I’ll tell him, no I’m sorry, he doesn’t play with other people. Move along.
Jon (17:38)
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Alonzo Banx (17:56)
Yeah, I just saw a great t-shirt about that tonight,
which says, if you’re flirting with me, please tap me on the shoulder and tell me because I’m kind of oblivious.
Jon (18:03)
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (18:04)
All right, wingman, wingwoman gone wrong. Or which can easily become cock blocking. Yes.
Heather (18:08)
Actually, I question. Has
John ever wingmaned for Patty? Or was it wingwomaned for Patty?
Patty (18:17)
He allowed me to sleep with his friends, so I mean, there’s that. Like, it’s really good friends. Friends are off limits now, but that was a good time when that was allowed. I don’t know if you’ve ever wingman for me, John, have you?
Jon (18:18)
I don’t know.
I just keep lining them up for her, you know? Everybody come on in!
Cupcake (18:24)
allowed me. Just
line out the door.
Jon (18:31)
you
I feel like I have in some ways, I don’t like… I think there was somebody in Vegas that I wingman for you, but that didn’t end up great. That was probably one of the Heather-ass. Really?
Patty (18:42)
I don’t think I need a wingman. I’m a flirt.
Cupcake (18:47)
Right?
Patty (18:53)
Heather has. Heather has wing manned for me. With
Heather (18:56)
I totally have.
Patty (18:57)
the partner that I have now. Is really, really handsome. And I felt like he was way out of my league. And was like, hey, look at that guy at a party. And she’s like, let’s go talk to him. I was like, I don’t know. And she just went right up and was like, Patty likes da da da da da.
Cupcake (19:00)
Bros.
Patty (19:16)
I won’t say it. And I was like, my god, my god, but we were dating now. so…
Jon (19:21)
Mm.
Alonzo Banx (19:24)
Somehow it’s easy to see Heather being rather outgoing with what she wants. ⁓
Patty (19:30)
She is, even if she talk
Jon (19:30)
You
Patty (19:32)
or blocks you, which she has done.
Heather (19:34)
Listen.
Cupcake (19:36)
Wow, man-hunter.
Alonzo Banx (19:38)
Okay, okay, come on now. This is the wing woman gone wrong story. And I got a comment on taco blocking. ⁓ no, it is. We are never appropriate. And I gotta say, that’s the first time I’ve heard that title. And it’s good.
Patty (19:46)
Sorry, that’s probably not appropriate, but that’s what it is.
Heather (19:46)
Yeah.
Cupcake (19:49)
Are Let’s go.
Heather (19:55)
Listen, I invited her
Jon (19:56)
You
Heather (19:58)
to a meet. It was just a meet and greet at a local brewery. Okay. So it was my date for the evening, right? Going into it, right? And so I had every intention going into it. was like, one thing Patty really likes is a slight bit of possessiveness. If you’re possessive over Patty, she’s like, Oh God. Yeah.
Patty (20:19)
You
Jon (20:22)
you
Heather (20:23)
her lady bits gets all happy.
It was my plan to go into that meeting room. Yes.
Patty (20:26)
You
Cupcake (20:28)
sauce for the taco.
Jon (20:30)
you
Patty (20:32)
you
Heather (20:34)
So at the meet and greet, anytime she was talking to a woman or flirting with another woman, I would beeline straight to her and be like, hi, I’m Heather, Patty’s girlfriend.
Jon (20:44)
you
Patty (20:46)
That’s not the taco blocking though. We went to a ladies night. Ladies night at a club we go to and it was she and I and there was this really really pretty girl and she was like, what are you guys up to tonight? What are you ladies up to tonight? Or what are you into tonight? Heather’s response? Into each other!
Heather (20:49)
What did I do?
Oh yeah, I did that too.
Patty (21:12)
We’re into each other. We have plans tonight. When we got into the back, I was like, what the hell? She’s like, you’re mine. You’re mine tonight. I was like, she could have been ours. Like, what are you doing?
Jon (21:16)
you
Cupcake (21:19)
⁓ no!
Heather (21:26)
To be fair, already had a plan for the evening on what I was going to do to Patty and it didn’t include a third person.
Cupcake (21:26)
Damn, I like it.
Patty (21:27)
⁓ it was so funny.
Yes.
Jon (21:36)
No.
Patty (21:37)
That was a good time though. I’m not gonna lie.
Heather (21:39)
Yeah,
if you’ve seen the Hunting Wives episode three, that’s what we did.
Cupcake (21:44)
Okay, the taco was dressed.
Jon (21:46)
Yeah.
Heather (21:47)
I liked this episode.
Jon (21:48)
Yeah.
Cupcake (21:49)
⁓ I mean, I can go into like, not necessarily a specific situation, but I
I don’t know if this, I mean this could happen to a lot of people, but does anyone else try to wing man and then realize that the people you’re trying to get together are more interested in you?
so i’ve and i’m trying to like but they’re just like more focused on me and i was like i see what’s happening here never mind
Jon (22:16)
think that did happen with me once, I can’t remember. Patty, do you remember that?
Where I was surprised that they were interested in me. Oh, yeah. There’s a couple. There’s a couple we had connected with several times before. So the male half of this couple was interested in having Patty and I come over with his wife’s…
Patty (22:26)
Wish.
Jon (22:44)
agreement to it stuff, whatever. was cool with it. So I think Patty was busy or something like that. And I said, hey, yeah, I don’t think we’re going to make it because Patty’s can be busy. He said, well, you can come over too. Well, OK, but that’s weird. What are we going to do, play a game or something? No clue that this dude was interested in me. And it took me forever to figure that out. You don’t?
Cupcake (22:58)
That’s weird.
Patty (23:03)
don’t remember who that was.
Jon (23:06)
I like hate us names. Yeah, so this is Well, we we didn’t we didn’t know that weekend I know I think I won. Yeah So We didn’t we didn’t I didn’t connect with them
Heather (23:07)
I’ve heard this story before.
Did you end up playing some games?
Cupcake (23:14)
What game did you play? Who won? That’s the real question.
Patty (23:14)
Are you
Heather (23:17)
quite difficult.
Cupcake (23:20)
Let’s see where we’re on top. Got it. Okay.
Jon (23:31)
that weekend that he was asking about it and stuff, whatever, but then we all got together as a foursome at some point. And that’s when he kind of like, I want to do things to you too. Oh, me? How is that even possible? I had no clue. I had no clue that he was even interested in dudes. Yeah.
Cupcake (23:42)
Who me?
You see, when a man loves a man,
Anything is possible.
Jon (23:53)
Yeah.
Heather (23:54)
I’m sorry.
Cupcake (23:56)
man, it reminds me of the conversation
when we were like, the birds and the bees and the cupcake and we’re like, what’s the cupcake? And I was like, you see, a cupcake loves a man and another man and a woman and maybe that man also likes what- that’s a cupcake.
Jon (24:10)
Hahaha!
Yes.
Alonzo Banx (24:12)
We’ve only strayed a little from the main theme tonight.
Jon (24:15)
you
Cupcake (24:16)
This
is not great though.
Alonzo Banx (24:17)
Okay, so we have discovered that wingmanning and wingwoman and taco blocking…
Cupcake (24:25)
Man, I’m hungry now.
Alonzo Banx (24:26)
Thanks.
Jon (24:28)
Pretend like I’m not here.
Alonzo Banx (24:30)
takes many forms.
I would ask who’s gonna help me close out tonight with the lessons learned, I mean all I got from tonight. Well no, no, I didn’t learn any term. I don’t know where else I’m gonna use it, but you know, taco blocking.
Cupcake (24:31)
Yeah, yeah it does.
I think we learned nothing. I had a great time!
Jon (24:43)
you
You
Heather (24:49)
Hey Alonzo,
we understood the assignment. We took it more lighthearted today, okay?
Alonzo Banx (24:53)
⁓ you
Patty (24:55)
you
Alonzo Banx (24:56)
Yes, I’m good.
Cupcake (24:56)
And now we’re all gonna get tacos. It’s gonna be great.
Jon (24:59)
You
Alonzo Banx (25:00)
Anyone have any final stories for the night as we wind this one down?
Cupcake (25:05)
you know, make sure you’re in the mood for Mexican food if you’re gonna…
Alonzo Banx (25:08)
You
Cupcake (25:10)
taco flocking.
Patty (25:11)
you
you
Cupcake (25:13)
And
I’m out.
Alonzo Banx (25:14)
Yeah.
Jon (25:15)
you ⁓
Alonzo Banx (25:17)
John,
Patty, come together. Thank you for a very fun evening. It’s been a pleasure. Good night, everybody.
Cupcake (25:25)
Thanks.
Patty (25:27)
Thank you.
Jon (25:28)
Thank you.