What does fear look like when you’re trying to love openly? In this episode, three men sit down to talk honestly about confidence, insecurity, aging, and the quiet ways anxiety shows up in polyamorous relationships. It’s not a debate or a lectureit’s a real conversation between friends who’ve lived the questions they’re asking. From feeling “replaceable,” to learning emotional maturity, to the unspoken pressures men carry in love, this episode hits close to home for anyone who’s ever wondered if they’re “enough.”
Alonzo, Jon, Noah
Alonzo Banx (00:01)
Welcome back to the Polysocal Podcast. I’m Oiz, I’m Alonzo Banks and back from a couple days off had Noah cover for me. Thank you, Noah. Tonight we’ve got a special podcast. It’s just going to be three of us men on tonight talking about responsibilities and how we handle our anxiety. So with that, hi guys.
Noah (00:23)
Hey, how’s it going?
Alonzo Banx (00:24)
Okay, so we’ll do a really short around everybody say hello and who they are, but I think everyone here is pretty well known to our audience. John, you want to kick it off?
Jon (00:34)
Sure, I’m John. I am a member of a four-person polycule. I am married, have a girlfriend, and I have a metamor named Bebe. Wife is Patty, she’s sometimes co-hosts, and Heather is my girlfriend.
Alonzo Banx (00:49)
Yeah. And welcome back as always, Mr. Noah.
Noah (00:54)
Yeah, I am Noah and I have a poly relationship with two women. We have Cookie, my primary nesting partner, and we have Cupcake, who is my second partner, who also has a husband, who is not necessarily a part of our whole dynamic, but it’s a kitchen table poly situation.
Alonzo Banx (01:17)
Well, tonight we’ve got a conversation that was actually brought up by ⁓ Cookie. And the question on the table is, how do fear and anxiety show up for men when it comes to practicing or considering polyamory?
How does it resonate with you guys? What do you think?
Noah (01:39)
I’m gonna let Jon go first on this one.
Jon (01:41)
Oh my lord have mercy. I’ll see now you just kicked me off a little anxiety. So that’s great. Um, so for me, uh,
So I think this was a topic that we brought up in a previous podcast and just talking about the different experience I think for men in poly and in swinging and stuff or whatever you come in No, you had some line there that was pretty Pretty strong in that that I think dick is cheap or something like that. So That’s definitely something that hits you right when you’re when you’re in it
You really start to it is really hard to not constantly think about whether or not you’re enough or whether you are better than somebody else like it’s it’s a internal battle of deciding whether or not you want to experience that expression that that Emotions or whatever, you know that if you want to go down that thought process if you want to travel down that the emotional road of
do I compare myself to other people? And what the heck am I comparing? So that’s something that comes up constantly. When somebody that you love meets somebody else that’s amazing and has attributes that are more incredible than yours and stuff, whatever, you’re like, what do you do with that? How do you process that? I always find it a challenge, but not an insurmountable challenge so far.
Alonzo Banx (03:16)
Yeah, I think that plays into that old joke of, you know, why don’t you have threesomes? Because I don’t need to disappoint two women at one time.
Noah (03:26)
That’s right.
Alonzo Banx (03:26)
But
in context, we have decades of experience sitting at this table right now. I mean, I think between us, I know I’ve been active for 35, 40 years. John, you’ve got a couple of years on. we, yeah. No, you’re the new kid on the block. You’ve only got a decade or so.
Jon (03:42)
Little.
Little over 30.
Noah (03:50)
Yeah, I’m the poly baby.
I’m the poly baby. To be fair, you know, I’ve been dating women for a long time, but yeah, poly, poly newbie for sure. For sure.
Alonzo Banx (03:56)
But, go ahead.
Jon (03:56)
Yeah.
Noah (04:02)
Yeah, no, I think, you know, I have some, you know, thoughts on the anxiety and I think it really covers a whole ton of situations where not only do you just in dating in general, but I think in the poly space as well. Yeah, you were comparing yourself to other men. I think that’s a big one.
You know, this guy over here is dating three, four other people, right? Clearly he’s got something that I don’t because I’m coming in here with only one other partner or I’m single or whatever the situation is, right? What makes him so special that makes him so attractive that everybody wants to be with him? I think that’s one aspect. I think another aspect is, you know, being a man and coming into a space where you are
You know perceived as a threat Which I think is relatively natural. You’re a threat to other men Who you might be trying to you know? Steal or take time away or whatever one of their partners, right? Or maybe you’re a threat because maybe someone they’re interested in wants to talk to you instead right, I think there’s also fears around Being a creep or
being rejected in general by the men or women who you’re interested in. And I think there’s probably a bunch of sub areas where we’re constantly worried about how we stack up against others, how we stack up against those who we’re trying to win over, and how we deal, especially if we’re new.
With all these new people and all in this new situation, maybe we’re unfamiliar with how things work, what the rules are, and you’re afraid of tripping up. I think all that kind of plays into the fears and anxiety that we have.
Alonzo Banx (05:54)
I think a of what you just said is like really interesting. ⁓ my guess is people listening to this podcast cold would not have expected your responses to be how you are perceived by others. A lot of what you said in there was I’m worried about looking like a creep. I’m worried about how other men perceive me when I come into an environment. It’s less about a performance anxiety or less about, I good enough? And more from what you were just saying.
Noah (06:06)
Hmm.
Alonzo Banx (06:22)
how other people are going to perceive you when you come into an environment.
Noah (06:27)
Yeah, I think for me that’s the case and just for everyone listening, I’m good enough. But no, no, I think, I think that is where more of my anxieties lie. I do have some confidence that I am good at working with people and learning about who they are, what they want, how they want it. And I do care about the people that I’m interacting with.
Alonzo Banx (06:33)
You
Noah (06:55)
even if it’s platonic, just so that we can kind of be on the same page. I don’t know that I would necessarily call myself a people pleaser, but I’m definitely someone who is interested in, you know, meeting people and making them feel comfortable, right? And I feel like with those needs on my side translate as someone who is relatively good at pinpointing the needs of others.
And so I think more of my anxiety comes from first impression anxiety, right? I walk into a room and what does everybody think of me immediately? Or the fear of one action erasing all of my good actions, right? Where, you know, there’s the old military joke to be crude, right? It is, you can build a hundred bridges, perfect bridges, but you suck one dick and you’re a cocksucker, right?
Jon (07:44)
Mm-hmm
Noah (07:45)
And, you know, while I have nothing against cocksuckers of all genders and types, that the point is, is that you have a reputation that can be tarnished through one misstep, one action or one misunderstanding. Right. And I think there’s a lot of fear around that of, you know, how would I deal with that? Hopefully I don’t have that happen to me. How can I make sure it doesn’t? And you can get in your head with that kind of stuff.
Jon (07:48)
Thanks. ⁓
Alonzo Banx (08:13)
I very much believe, however, that fear is good for us, that there’s a layer, there’s a layer of fear that keeps us on our toes, keeps us connected. And I think you have to be very cognizant of all of the things you just said as you enter a room. That coming into this room, especially as a dumb male, you have to be very hyper aware of those things. And if your motivation for being cognizant of all that, it’s just a little hint of fear.
Jon (08:17)
⁓ you
Alonzo Banx (08:42)
then that fear is probably a good thing and makes you someone who’s welcome into that room.
Noah (08:48)
I would agree with that. Absolutely. I think that’s absolutely true. think it helps keep us reasonable. Maybe that’s not the perfect term, but you know, it helps us keep level a little bit and not stomp on people and take up all the space in the room.
Alonzo Banx (09:03)
Exactly.
And I’m sure there’s some psychologists listening to us right now telling you that wants to chime in and say there are healthier places for that to come from. And they’re right. But as long as it comes from some place, it’s a good thing. John?
Noah (09:20)
Yeah,
I think I’ll think a little bit. think it’s when it becomes paralyzing is when we have problems, right? When it makes you look at your shoes and, you know, not really be sure about what you want to say. Having a hard time even just smiling because you’re so self-conscious you can’t even think about I need to express that I’m happy in this situation, right? I think that’s when fear becomes detrimental or anxiety becomes detrimental. But I think it can absolutely be used as a
as a tool. If you can keep it somewhat under control, if you’re able to overcome that deep anxiety, that deep fear of failure.
Alonzo Banx (09:56)
You have to be able to function with it.
Noah (09:59)
Mm-hmm.
Jon (10:03)
I totally agree with Victor on this one too, just that experience of seeing other men make that mistake, right? Like in a party situation or an event situation where something goes wrong. They drink too much and make some really bad decisions and do some things that alienate themselves from the rest of the group. And ⁓ that sticks with them, especially if it’s sponsored sort of hosted party.
at a venue or something like that, know, like the club that we go to and stuff, whatever, if you make a big mistake in this club, then you’re out of there and stuff, whatever, you’re not coming back. And it’s difficult to get out of that. I’ve been watching this guy that I knew pretty closely, we used to hang out quite a bit and he’s just getting alienated from large groups of people because of his behavior on one party and…
And it’s, tough to watch, but it makes sense. You know, you’re like, gosh, this guy’s the canary, guess, or something. You know, he’s like the person who makes the mistake that other people see and be like, okay, not doing that. Not going to behave like that. And that’s a good thing that fear is okay in that situation where you’re like, yeah, then we’re never going to do that. That’s crazy. It keeps you, I think, I think that’s part of the social sort of experience to.
know how to behave. I think that’s where the real morals come from is learning from the people around you, not so much where you might read it from a book or something like that. I think you develop it with your surroundings. So just part of that process to me.
Noah (11:38)
Mm-hmm.
Alonzo Banx (11:41)
But we live in an environment where everyone’s safety is paramount. And because of that, people are kind of hyper aware. And when you have someone who makes a faux pas, we do live in a one and done world. I’ve seen over my time, many people get ostracized from groups, many people uninvited from future things, which does add
to the anxiety, but unfortunately it’s not a false anxiety. It is true. If you do something wrong, that ends up happening, which you have to stay on your toes. So there, you when we brought up this topic, there are a lot of kinds of anxieties. It’s funny, as long as I’ve been at this, I’m very cautious. I don’t step on those kinds of landmines. My anxiety comes in from almost a different direction, which is my biggest anxieties are at my age.
my partners want to fly to Europe for the weekend, or they want to go on this trip and walk the Camino for the next two months. And it’s like, I still work. I’m still bringing in an active income. It’s like, I can’t take off to Europe for a week. ⁓ but my other partner can take me and go there.
Jon (12:38)
You
Thank
Noah (12:52)
Hmm.
Alonzo Banx (12:54)
So my anxiety comes in from the fact that, okay, in a way, I’m not good enough. Do you want to go to Europe? I can’t take you to Europe next week, I’m working. So, you know, there is a lot of different angles. That’s why when this topic came up, I’m like, wow, which way are we even gonna take it? Because there is so many different ways to look at it.
Jon (13:11)
Right.
Noah (13:15)
There really are. Yeah, and I think on your point specifically, you know, there is a, and this is true in any kind of dating, really any kind of friendship, I would say is true too. We tend to match up typically with folks who are in our same, I don’t know, social circle, right? And that can be based on income levels or job type or what have you, right?
Blue-collar folks tend to hang out a lot of blue-collar folks, right? I have a white-collar job sitting at a desk all day a real soft hands real weak strong real real weak muscles, right? And that’s who I end up hanging out with all the time, right? If we need to build a house Probably not gonna be able to do that for you. We’re gonna have to go hire some people, right? That being said I’m also not a rich man. And so yeah if I have
a partner who wants to go on fancy dinners and go dancing every night or go travel to another country or what have you on a whim, I’m not going to be able to provide that. And I think that would be hard for me. And I think I probably tend to weed those types of partners out on my side, either accidentally or on purpose. They weed me out too, I’m sure, right? But because I’m never going to be able to keep up, I’ll never be enough.
And I don’t necessarily want that in my life either. Right? I don’t want someone who’s always after me to pay for their stuff, I guess. But yeah.
Alonzo Banx (14:41)
Yeah, and beyond that, none of us want to wake up every day feeling like we’re not enough. No matter how that plays out, you want to feel like you are scratching your partner’s itch to continuously feel like you’re not. It can be a problem.
Noah (14:46)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (14:57)
John,
you’re smiling away.
Jon (14:59)
Yeah, I, so this one kind of hit home a little bit on the fact that I was, became unemployed at the end of January this year. And, uh, uh, and that was a rough hit. I’d been with the company for almost 15 years and stuff, whatever. thought I was going to retire there and stuff. thought I was just coasting into the, into retirement at that place and, uh, found out very abruptly that that was not the case. And, uh,
So I had been looking for work for the longest time and just hunting, hunting and pushing and networking and all the stuff that you have to do to get the job. And, it was getting pretty bad until a couple of weeks ago, I finally got a call back saying that I did get this job that it was, it was possibly the perfect scenario job for me. So was like, my God, finally, but all that during that time, I’ve been dating Heather now for just over a year. So, so she met me when I was employed and then
and then endured this extended amount of unemployment time and stuff, whatever. And, and though I had funds to keep my life moving and stuff, whatever, I wasn’t like, Hey, let’s go do some wild and crazy trips and all these things and stuff or whatever that it might’ve been able to do had I been employed all this time. So there was a moment there when I finally got the job and then I reached out to Heather and was just thanking her for hanging in with me on that, on that ride and stuff, whatever. But that came from that same kind of place that anxiety about.
You know, am I, I’m not the same person I was in the very beginning of this relationship. And, uh, and I’ve been struggling for a couple of months here for sure. And it’s just like, Oh God, this is going to be rough. Uh, so I got lucky that I found a place to go, um, but yeah, it was, it was a challenge because it really, whole, you know, that I don’t know that that internal working that says that you should be the,
the protector and provider and all that stuff or whatever that was really like stabbed. So that part was dying in me and I couldn’t figure out how that was coming off on the other end of that.
Alonzo Banx (17:03)
Yeah, it’s rough. by the way, I wanted to congratulate you on the job. I know we had talked about that offline and I wasn’t going to do it until you brought it up. You brought it up. So congratulations. Super happy for you. ⁓
Jon (17:09)
Thank you. All right. Thank you. Thank you.
I’m happy to.
Alonzo Banx (17:17)
Yeah, no, for me, I think that’s at this point in my life, when you, as soon as you brought up this topic of anxiety, the how to enter a room, to, that’s second nature. And you’re right, it absolutely is anxiety, but it’s so built into me at this point. It’s like, that’s just how I function. But the anxiety that I’ve been facing as I age is, you know, there’s a thing that’ll happen to you and hopefully you gentlemen will never get here.
where you walk over and you’re going to pick up a 50 pound bag of cement. And in your mind, you know, you can pick up two of them. I mean, it’s just a bag of cement. And you reach down and your body goes, no, not anymore. That’s five years ago. You’re like, of course I can. No, no, can’t do that. And you start realizing that, I’m really not the man I was.
Jon (17:44)
Hehehehe
.
Alonzo Banx (18:05)
And then you start getting into the money. It’s like, okay, life changes. Now you’re on a fixed income. You can’t afford those weekends in Vegas. You can’t afford those crazy trips. And the anxiety starts hitting you of, am I even dateable anymore? My identity had been built around all of that. And when all of that’s taken away, you’re left going, wow, what am I under that now?
That’s what I know when you brought this conversation up tonight, you said, that’s going to be a deep one for me because that anxiety is a very real thing that I face. It came up in a conversation today where we were talking about just this and it was, but I, I am not in that position to give you the things that you need. And I can say at this age, I never will be again.
Jon (18:36)
Yeah. ⁓
Noah (18:43)
Hmm.
you
Alonzo Banx (18:58)
So… Ouch.
Noah (19:03)
Yeah, yeah. I think it’s hard to, you know, I’m trying to put myself in your shoes a little bit, right? I mean, as we get older, I’m midlife now. I understand now what it’s like to kind of go, well, there’s an end to all of this. How am going to live my life with that in mind, right? It’s not an uncommon thought process to have at my age. And
Yeah, you start not only evaluating everything that you do, but evaluating your worth and evaluating how you’re going to adapt to those things. And as time goes on, a lot of those things become out of your control. Like you said, you’ve come on a fixed income. You have less mobility or whatever, and eventually…
It turns into, well, I can only offer this. So if you’re not interested, then I guess move on, but then you move on. It’s cool. Now I got to start all over again, right? I mean, that’s, that’s rough. That’s rough. I, I, I get it.
Alonzo Banx (20:05)
But to answer the kind of sub question is how do you deal with it? I know for me, I’m very upfront about it with my partners. I mean, almost too early in a relationship, I’m like, hey, you need to know this going in. You know, this is who I am. This is what I am now. And unfortunately for me, a lot of my past is public. So people come to me with an expectation of who I was.
Noah (20:05)
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (20:31)
So you then have to start with, but I’m kind of not that guy anymore. I’m not the person I was when this happened. That was 20 years ago. I’m older now. And I find that the way that I cope with my anxiety is putting it right up front. Is making it part of the conversation, is being very upfront with my partners and go, look, this is who I am and it’s not fun to say this and it’s not…
Noah (20:34)
Hmm.
Alonzo Banx (20:57)
It doesn’t make me feel good, but it does clear the air and let me get out of that anxiety. It lets me explain.
Jon (21:08)
You know, I think for me, it’s, I, me, it’s important to know what I’m bringing to the table, emotionally and, and perhaps physically and stuff, whatever that’s part of it too. But, like when I think about, what anybody means to me, like Patty has been with me for a very long time. and we’ve been through so many different things. We’ve been through.
just poverty and getting the dream jobs and her having a business and her losing one and physical stuff happening, some scary stuff here and there and everything. We’ve been through so many different things. And the most important thing throughout all of that was really about who we are to each other, the respect that we have for each other, the trust that we have with each other and how we treat each other seems to be the most important thing.
⁓ It has been at least from my experience and I’m and I’m pretty sure that’s what it’s been for Patty to is Just that feeling of like okay for us, you know, we’re in this together forever and and And and we take some comfort in that so I have that with Patty but with Heather It’s it’s a building of that that same feeling of like I’m there for you. I’m
I want you to be happy. want you to feel good in your life and stuff, whatever. And it doesn’t end up ever really being about the contents of my pocket or my bank account or anything like that, there’s no gifts that I’m giving that is making this a relationship that’s working really well for me. It’s really about just how much of my heart I’m pouring into it and soaking up the love in return.
I think that that ends up being the most important thing. So defining yourself by that sometimes might be, could be a healthier way of looking at it than warning them about who you are and stuff or whatever.
Alonzo Banx (22:57)
You
Noah (22:58)
Nyehehehehe
Alonzo Banx (22:59)
So John, I have the privilege of knowing you fairly well. And I will say with no hesitation, you are probably one of the most calm, grounded, emotionally connected humans I know. I’ve never seen anything rattle you. never seen… I’m sure you managed to get upset.
Jon (23:16)
You
Alonzo Banx (23:19)
But I think you’re the only human that I know who I’ve never seen you be anything but kind and open and compassionate. And I think something that Noah said just a bit ago, which was you filter out the people that don’t fit around you. And I think you filtered in the people that understand your incredible value, which is that emotional balance is about the best word that I can use.
I am envious of you, the way, because I have watched it many times and gone, how do I channel my inner John? Because he’s so good at that and I am so Sicilian. My emotions are a roller coaster. I’m up, I’m down, I’m somewhere in the middle. I’m all over and you just see how the steady kind of, wow, you are my idol in that context.
Noah (23:57)
Yeah.
Jon (24:08)
I appreciate that.
Noah (24:12)
Yeah, I don’t know John as well, but I’ve only witnessed the same. So I would agree with that. Yeah. You know, not to change gears too much, but I do have like a personal experience that I wouldn’t mind sharing actually, based around this. So, you know, recently I was at an event with both of my partners and you know, we were treating this event. So let me back up just a little bit here, you know, as
Jon (24:15)
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (24:25)
Please.
Noah (24:38)
you know, and the audience may know, I’m, you know, into the BDSM side of things, right? On top of being Polly, which has its own anxiety things that I wouldn’t mind talking about more too, if we had time, but this would be in relation to that. And we were treating this space as a play space for the few days that we were there. And, you know, this event has thousands of people.
And, you know, a lot of them are friends of us or friends of other friends. And so you meet a lot of new people, meet a lot of acquaintances. One of these new people that I had met was a friend of one of my partners. They’ve been friends for quite a while, what have you, but it was really the first time I had met them in person. I’d only, you know, talked to them online basically before. And very cool person, really liked this person a lot.
⁓ but we had gone back to a relatively isolated place with my partner that knew her. And, there was a moment where my partner did something that I would usually say something for, right? So I’m in a dominant position. She’s my submissive. She did something that isn’t great. And I dressed her down right in front of her friend. Now I can make up all sorts of excuses. I was drunk.
I was excited by the environment. had forgotten where I was because we had been in this space for so long that I was someone else. the reality is that I personally feel like I crossed a boundary. I dressed her down and I had a smile on my face. I was kind of being playful about it, but I was serious and was being aggressive about it. All right in front of her friend. And her friend didn’t take that very well. And I think rightfully so.
And I was put in this position where I had to apologize and what have you. And I think, you know, this was one of those moments that I thought I was better than, and I wasn’t. And I suddenly felt like, great, now not only does this person not like me, it makes my partner maybe question whether I’m a great partner, right? On top of that, their friend is questioning whether I’m a great partner. And maybe I’m stressing out their relationship.
because maybe if she wants to continue to be around me, she doesn’t feel like I’m very safe, right? This is all things that I’m concerned about, I’m worried about. And I think I’ve been able to apologize and explain things and smooth this one over, maybe, we’ll see, long-term. But yeah, it was definitely not my proudest moment and one that affected me.
Jon (27:15)
I’m curious about this. You said you’re at an environment or an event that that that BDSM was part of the theme, right?
Noah (27:25)
It’s a, it’s
a friendly event, but it is not a BDSM event. I don’t really want to say what it is to dox myself or whatever, but yeah, I think, you know, it’s a festival event, where BDSM is tangentially part of the culture, but it isn’t a primary focus and it’s not what everybody’s into. So, ⁓ you know, I’m not out in the streets, you know, exercising this. still a little bit more private than that. However,
Jon (27:30)
okay. Okay.
Okay. Okay.
Noah (27:52)
it’s generally more accepted than just out at the mall, for instance.
Jon (27:56)
Right.
OK. Yeah, I wasn’t sure. Given the environment, thought, seems like it might have been OK and an inappropriate thing to do within the dynamic of your relationship. And then it could have been a palatable to the person who was with you, because they would know. But if they’re not aware and taken by surprise by that, then yeah, it’s probably like, hey, what? I get it.
Alonzo Banx (28:18)
Well, we’ve had that.
Noah (28:18)
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (28:19)
We and we’ve had that happen that our events at poly SoCal events are not pink events. They are not blatantly sexual events. it’s a couple of people have stepped on the lines before, one of them being me. You know, that gone on that edge and gone, oh, did I go too far? Well, this is an accepting event. Was it an appropriate thing to do at that event?
And I think you were both there at the time.
Jon (28:52)
Yeah.
I had no problem with everything that happened that event. my god. One of my favorite parts of that was how Patty reacted to you, Noah, after that first whap. turned, like, that’s it? Just challenged you,
Alonzo Banx (28:56)
in fairness, it was my birthday.
Noah (28:57)
Hahaha.
That’s right. That’s right.
Alonzo Banx (29:02)
you
You
Noah (29:11)
⁓ Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it wasn’t Alonzo, you know,
Jon (29:16)
Yeah.
Noah (29:16)
I’m pretty sure she had that first and then I came up afterwards and you know, I don’t have quite that expertise. I’m working on it. I’m working on it. But you know, that that’s the other side of things, right? I mean, speaking of that, right, speaking of spanking women, you know, there’s anxiety around either a even if I’m talking with my friends and a more like
Jon (29:23)
I’m
Noah (29:38)
who are vanilla typically, right? just having, and I’m being crude when I say this, but you know, it’s, hey, I love tying up women and beating them, right? It doesn’t really go over very well in most social circles, right? And obviously there’s a lot more nuance to this. There’s a lot of consent involved and you know, aftercare and all that, right? But you know, on the surface, a lot of people don’t understand this and…
Jon (29:48)
Yeah.
Noah (30:04)
It can make it something that you’re very excited about and want to share and talk about in the right circles, you think are the right circles anyways, and maybe you don’t get the reactions that you want. Right?
Alonzo Banx (30:14)
Not everyone understands. know you’re in a relationship with Cupcake, and I guess I can talk about this because I’ve talked to both of you about this today. I’m doing a private interview with her coming up in a couple of episodes and talking to her, delving specifically into how strong and comforting she feels by being yourself. And I think that’s something that most people would not
instantly understand is the value to her. And I’ll let her speak for herself and everyone wait for that podcast and listen to it because it’s going to be good. But yeah, I don’t think most people would get that right away.
So we were talking about anxieties and while we dovetailed off into some fun stuff. I think from my perspective so far is a little bit of anxiety is good. It keeps us on our toes. There’s a point where anxiety becomes paranoia or anxiety causes you problems in relationships. Anyone have a good story of where your anxiety specifically got the better of you?
Jon (31:01)
Hahaha.
Alonzo Banx (31:24)
And perhaps you did something stupid in a relationship, said something stupid to someone out of fear of something that was purely anxiety-based.
Jon (31:36)
Yeah, I’ve got one. So this was a previous relationship prior to Patty. This was the first person that I ever fell in love with. I was a jealous dude. I was young and just getting into my own skin and stuff, whatever. was 19 at the time and stuff. at the time, I was dating this woman.
I always had this, I don’t know if it was from an insecurity or what it was, but I just always felt like, you know, she doesn’t really want me. She probably wants somebody else. And I’m, I’m feeling all this kind of weird stuff. And I had been like staying with her and had gone through like her drawers. And I found this book of like poetry and I started to read some of the poetry that she had written in this book. And it was just like talking about this guy that she didn’t.
wasn’t connecting with what wanted and all this stuff or whatever. And it was just like, my God, like it’s true. Like all of those fears and stuff, whatever. And, and I thought, you know, it made me so upset. And then at some point I just finally confronted her about it. and, and she’s like, what are you talking about and stuff? And I showed her the book and she’s like, those are lyrics to songs I like, by the cure. I’m like, like, ⁓ my God, I’m an idiot. This is the worst.
It’s just I don’t know it was like really that’s when I found out that’s when I kind of learned that whole lesson of That you’re gonna find what it is that you’re looking for. So if you’re looking for some kind of Infidelity or whatever it is that you’re looking for from somebody else you’re gonna Probably gonna force that situation at some point if you are gonna be that anxious about it. So ⁓ Yeah
Noah (33:21)
Yeah, would even
venture so far as to say that you, it’s hard to say cause it, but would push someone into that if they’re aware of your anxiety and the constant fear and judgment and whatever. know, eventually you might, it might be a self-fulfilling prophecy, right?
Jon (33:27)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Yeah,
you manifest it. You think about it enough, it becomes true.
Alonzo Banx (33:41)
And you’re touching on another future podcast, is what we put out there is what we get back. The attitude that we put out to the world is really what they come back at you with. So how do you know, what’s your internal warning signs for when your anxiety is justified and when it’s just anxiety? What little flags go off for you when you go,
wait a minute, this isn’t real real. This is panic real.
Noah (34:14)
For me personally, actually, and maybe this is something that I’ve learned over time, but I don’t let it get there anymore. And what I mean by that is, at least with people that I’ve already had some sort of relationship with, if I’m feeling anxious about something, I confront as too aggressive, but I open up and I talk about it with my partners or with my friends or whoever it is I’m discussing things with. And I think…
that really helps head a lot of this off. because I, what happens with anxiety, myself too, and others is you do this loop in your head and then with every loop you add more and more and more things, right? ⁓ what if they’re cheating on me? What if they’re cheating on me with Brad? What if they’re cheating on me with Brad right now? this is happening right now. I know this is happening because she hasn’t talked to me in three days or whatever, right? Like eventually you’ve built up this whole fantasy.
nightmare scenario in your head and you’re not letting it, you’re not releasing it. And I think as soon as you’re able to express yourself in a healthy way, hey, I’m having these feelings, you know, can you help me understand what’s happening right now? I think goes a long ways in preventing spiraling out of control with that anxiety.
Jon (35:31)
Yeah, I’m almost the same on that. For me, it’s that over communication and stuff, whatever it’s communicate constantly and try to be open and vulnerable if at all humanly possible, it’s going to be valuable. But one other thing that I do is I don’t like to communicate electronically so much. I feel like it’s an incomplete way of communicating everything that should be communicated in that moment. So I shelf things.
⁓ early on, like, okay, well, I’m going to talk about this when we get together. I’m not going to, like, dwell on it right now. I’ll put it on the shelf for later. We’ll talk about it and live my life. I think that’s part of what keeps me calm in a lot of situations. It’s like, I’m just waiting for that moment for us to talk one-on-one and face-to-face and truly communicate about something.
Alonzo Banx (36:23)
I think you overlook what a skill that is, John. I can tell you that the ability to shelf something and wait until the proper opportunity to talk to it is part of what I was talking about with you, is that emotional maturity that allows you to do that, that some of us struggle with a little more than you.
Jon (36:32)
You
Noah (36:48)
And John, correct me if I’m wrong. You know, perhaps, perhaps this might be some secret to this. I can’t claim that I’m quite as, you know, stoic and Buddha-like like you, but ⁓ I feel like I’ve grown in that area myself a little bit. And a lot of it has been realizing that in general, most people, especially the ones that I want to associate with, are generally good and generally mean well and
Jon (36:50)
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (37:00)
you
Jon (37:00)
Yeah.
Noah (37:16)
mean well for me, right? And I should always assume the best first and not assume the worst first, right? If I’m assuming the worst, that’s coming from something else that has nothing to do with the person that I’m dealing with. It’s all from me, from my past experiences or traumas or relationships, whatever it is, I’m taking something into it. And if I assume the best in them first and say, okay, there’s probably a reasonable explanation, I should go find out what that is.
before I go down this path of destruction, right? And I’m assuming that’s at least part of your thought process as well.
Jon (37:55)
Yeah. so I, I do generally think that about most people, whether it’s relationships or friendships or anything like that. And, and for me, I almost have a zero tolerance policy about if somebody comes at me with something, then they’re trying to hurt me with something. I’ll, I will make some distance, emotional, physical distance. I’m just like, okay, I don’t want you in my circle of my world and stuff, whatever. I don’t want you, I want you causing damage and stuff, whatever. So
I’m usually pretty quick to distancing myself when I know it’s toxic. But I think the result of that is that people that end up in your circle that you collect as friends and people that you fall in love with are people who have your best intentions in mind and that you have theirs in mind and stuff, whatever. don’t know. It’s just for me, I don’t know if that’s a good thing or a bad thing, but I think the result is that
I have been surrounding myself with better better people over time.
Noah (38:53)
I think you’d be hard pressed if it’s bad.
Alonzo Banx (38:53)
John, say it’s a…
Yeah, hard for us to say it’s bad. And you know, we’re all human. I mean, we all are doing our best to get through this life and get what we need and not hurt those near us.
Jon (38:55)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Alonzo Banx (39:08)
Any
final thoughts for people coming into this world and dealing with their anxieties? And as we’ve discussed, anxiety comes from a lot of different directions. So it’s kind of hard to give one piece of catch-all advice.
Noah (39:28)
John, do mind if I go first? Just because I think you might have the better final words.
Alonzo Banx (39:28)
Good.
Jon (39:30)
Go for it.
Noah (39:32)
No, you know what? John just has a lot
of experience and I think he has the right mindset and I think he’s got a lot of good advice. So I want to get mine out of the way and let him be the final word. I think for me personally, the idea of polyamory in general, and this is a very high level general thought process is people have
Jon (39:39)
Yeah.
Noah (39:54)
At least the people who interested in this have a lot of love to give and want to receive a lot of love. And I think if you come into, you know, this arena per se as, as someone who is looking for and wanting to give love and assuming that and the others around you, you’ll come into the space in a much better place versus defensive
and scared. And so if you can realize that when you come there, that again, these are generally loving people who if you are showing love, they will likely react positively to you. Great. And if they don’t fuck them walk away.
Jon (40:37)
You
words right out of my mouth, ⁓ So for me, the advice would be to be patient, be patient with the people that you’re around and be patient with yourself and learn to shelf things, I guess, would be important too. And just the value of communicating in person, I think is huge for me. see things, I see struggles so much from
Alonzo Banx (40:42)
you
Jon (41:06)
texting back and forth and what did he mean by this? What is she trying to say in here and stuff, whatever, and it’s all just solved in a conversation that you have in front of the other person. So having patience to wait for that conversation I think is important because all of that other stuff ends up getting in the way and becomes a hurdle over time. So that would be my.
main recommendation and continue bringing people who are good in your life closer to you and treat them well and the toxic people welcome.
Alonzo Banx (41:38)
Gentlemen, thank you very much for tonight. think we covered the topic. I was questioning what was going to happen as we went in. John, Noah, as always, thank you. You’re amazing on the table. Thanks for coming in tonight. And this is Alonzo Banks. This has been the Poly SoCal Podcast. And thank you. Good night, everyone.
Jon (41:45)
You